Government Considers Reviewing Anti-Dowry Laws

"ladke wale" are very smart now.When they don't ask for anything material, they'll ask for service .. "our 300 people will come for marriage, we should have a 3 day marriage. We should be put up in an Airconditioned accomodation. Transport will have to be provided. This should be the menu. Everyone should be gifted a return gift." & what not !

And is this better than the traditional model of demanding money or goods ?

Dowry can be eliminated by marrying girls who are well educated and standing on their own feet, to a boy of same or lower socio-economic status. But the girls family always want a groom of better status and preferably an NRI. Here the girls side is at fault, yearning for something which they themselves want to 'buy/acquire' with money!

In many cases the girl is actually denied the ancestoral property by just giving a paltry sum as dowry. This should be solved by equal inheritance. Here the girls side is at fault, trying to deny her share by paying a paltry sum as dowry.

This is the case of educated, working girls coming from middle class and upwards.

Let the girls start marrying downwards and eliminate dowry, why aspire for a groom who is upper than the girls family in status?.

!!!!Let the girls start marrying downwards and eliminate dowry, why aspire for a groom who is upper than the girls family in status?!!!!

Good point, accepted by very less girls and their parents. here some wishes of girls..

1) he must be handsome ( fair)
2) he must be in a better position than her ( some argue that it is the men who feel insecure to marry the women who are superior to them socially or economically, but it is not true nowadays).

3)Must belongs to same cast. the funny thing is girls and modern women sees only dowry as the evil, but not the cast system. The women who have some modern thinking about dowry has pathetic thinking when it comes to cast (of course not all women).

498a IPC is just a weapon in the hand of unscrupulous element and it has nothing to do with gender. Arrogant and ill educated unleash legal terrorism u/s 498a IPC by the advice of her parents and lawyer when she is caught red handed in some fraud. SC has long before identified its misuse and termed it legal terrorism. Now we are waiting just to hear that 498a IPC is legal rape of husband's family. I have witnessed that Shatir Criminal hatch diabolic frame up and cover it u/s 498a IPC for some monetary benefit or to insult husband's family to keep control on husband to keep husband separate from his old and dilapidated parents.

Dowry is not the problem...Greed is.

And In case of Dowry(atleast at the time of marriage), The greed is that of the girl and her parents who want to marry "up" their daughter by bribing groom and family.


And then If there are so many men who can stay bachelor, why can not a woman stay bachelor if she does not get a groom of her choice.

"ladke wale" are very smart now.

Yes, very true...

But...ladkii Walas still use old tatics of banking upon family property, zameen-jaidad and earning of the groom while hunting for the most rich, capable but affordable guy for their daughter so that he can provide a lifestyle to her the rest of the life.

BTW, hunting down the guy with fattest paycheck/ money in his pocket, which he can expend on them is not unique to parents of the bride. I am sure we all know about plethora of gold diggers world wide.

LAW should be gender equal, it is unfair to assume that all the girls family are true in their allegation and all the husband family are money seekers. On the other hand it is the fact that husbands family provide the residence to women in more than 99% cases and girls family treat their daughter or sisters as burden and hide behind the word so called dowry.
If any one harrase other for any money and property the same to be tried under IPC blackmailing and extrotion law.
Dowry is a bogus word created to do the legal terrorism, nothing else.
Let accept the truth and be honest, as false and lie can't withstand too long.

Families who educate their girl children do not have to worry, they will get married on 'Merits', unlike uneducated girls(whose parents will promptly educate their sons!, but deny education to their girls since 'Beti toh paraaya ghar ki hein'(a girl child will anyway belong to some other family after marrige).

And hence these uneducated girls, who can't live alone standing on their feet, nor get a boy who is able to support them(why would a well placed boy marry an uneducated girl, when he can expect to get married to a girl of his education level), will have to be married by 'buying' grooms.

See http://at498a.blogspot.com/2008/05/laison-with-industry-against-legal.html for more in this line.

So educate the girl child, be open to marry down, and do not deny equal inheritance to your girl child.

And then we would have eliminated a major chunk of what is projected as the 'menace of dowry'. And India can thus hope to break out of its image of wife-beaters and bride-burners- the pitch which Ministry of Women and child development, National commission of women and CSR, etc. are intentionally and falsely drumming up for getting their annual funds(which amounts to more than 7000 crores/year just in case of NCW)

What does "marrying downwards" even mean?! What is this word usage: Downwards. What generation do some of you belong to...or maybe I should ask what village.

A look through the current comment thread and it would seem to a non-Indian that Indian marriages are some sort of a business merger, like a smaller company should merge with a larger one so not to affect personnel or stock market value etc. A marriage is supposed to be about two people wanting to spend their life together and are compatible. Viewing a marriage with a business strategist's perspective takes away all the good stuff about being in a committed relationship.

When two people are compatible, in love and want to be in a committed relationship, it doesn't matter if one has a job and the other doesn't, if one is richer, the other is poorer. The two people should ideally be making this decision knowing all these things and being ok with them. Even in an arranged marriage dont the people know what they want before venturing on a bride/ groom hunt? How can he suddenly land up with an uneducated girl? I just don't get it. How bizarre.

Or do people suddenly wake up one day to realize that "Oops I'm marrying "downwards" therefore must need a dowry!".

How dumb.

You know how Indians can stop the menace of dowry: STOP ASKING FOR IT OR PAYING FOR IT.

I know some acquaintances from Andhra. The girl is a doctor in the US. Her parents are looking for a suitable boy and have already made arrangements for a handsome dowry. So, there goes the "educate your girl child and marry "downwards". theory.

FF # 6

You have caught the root of evil.

It is greed that is the trouble. To control greed law plays an important role. Dharma plays even more important role in shaping the character of humans that enables them to control the greed.

Traditionally in India girls were not given share in parental property in lieu of duty of brothers to act as like long security for sisters.

At least twice a year brothers have to send gifts corns, clothees etc to sister till she is alive and in many cases even after her death. It were months of saawan and Falgun.

In addition to this Brothers enjoying share of sisters in parental property were bound to help sister financially in any marraige ceremony of sisters's kids through a tradition known as `Bhaat'.

This all a brother has to share with sister all through her life above the dowry given at time of marriage.

Such were creative ideas our forfathers used to ensure share of girls in parental property. It was indierct and beautiful and ensured life long love between brotehrs and sisters and in other generations as well.

Greed has spoiled the whole scene though.

Now todays legal methods to ensure equal share to girls is most welcome. However we should be ready to face th brunt of human relationships while implememnting these laws in which sister got married 1000 miles away will find it hard to manage her property in village.

How a one room shelter father used to bring up two kids one boy and one girl will be divided.

mathematics will work and will bring justice to women for sure but at the cost of destrcution of that beautiful way ourforfathers designed the system in whcih sister used to get her share without any poisoning of hearts or human relations.

THe women ministry is lying to press delibrately as usual. This meeting is not for dowry law misuse prevention. Check www.ghrs.in ( Seminars and Dharnas) Scaned copy of the invitation letter.

They want to involve mens rights activists for women empowerment.

Check truth , by scaned letter of WCD.

http://www.ghrs.in/images/Dharna_Seminar/wcd%20letter.pdf

Check truth , by scaned letter of WCD.

http://www.ghrs.in/images/Dharna_Seminar/wcdletter.pdf

Just a simple question to all the Dowry-givers!
Do ALL the guys in the world ask you dowry when you want to marry your girl?

WHY DO YOU MARRY A GIRL TO A PERSON WHO ASKS DOWRY, AND THEN CRY HOARSE OVER IT?

STOP MARRYING YOUR GIRLS TO PEOPLE WHO ASK FOR DOWRY! As simple as that, to stop the dowry system in the country. It can't be stopped by passing such horrendously stupid laws and making sure they're grossly misused.

@seema

!!!!!What generation do some of you belong to.....!!!!

hmm.. i can explain, but there is proverb in telugu... the translation for that is," you can wake=up a sleeping person, but not the one who is pretending like that". So explaining what is downwards to you is not meaningful.

!!!!A marriage is supposed to be about two people wanting to spend their life together and are compatible.!!!!

you are right about the marriage. But tell me, if anybody thinks about economic side of the marriage really affects their relationship in future? obsoletely not (most of the times). If yes, in india divorce rate must be very high compared to other countries in the world. Still India is better.. compared to other countries where there is no dowry.

!!!!When two people are compatible, in love ...!!!

true,only if that man and women in love... generally in india, love marriages are very less compared to arranged marriages...

The example you gave( US doctor... marrying..), is the perfect example to marrying downward. that means you know what it is? that's why i said the proverb "wake-up a sleeping person..". And i am sure there is no dowry in your example. So why not girls do the same...?

www.BIOLOGICALsce.blogspot.com

@ seema

your friends parents "have already made arrangements for a handsome dowry" - so whose mistake is it anyway!?.

Let the girl resist the 'purchase' of an NRI groom for her. Find a guy with a smilar wavelength, so she need not marry up or down, let her just marry(if this is not possible, get ready for the parents sale proposal, whether it is upwards or downwards).

I am talking about the villages like your friend is living, its a fact of life there, hope you don't resist the truth anymore.

If anyone wants to change the system, get out of it and lead by example(and not arrange for handsome dowry and wait for a US groom/bakra!). If she is educated let her work and find someone worthy herself, whats so impossible in that?. Tell your friend and see what she tells you, no need to tell us, but u will understand which village we all are in!.

@ seema

your friends parents "have already made arrangements for a handsome dowry" - so whose mistake is it anyway!?.

Let the girl resist the 'purchase' of an NRI groom for her. Find a guy with a smilar wavelength, so she need not marry up or down, let her just marry(if this is not possible, get ready for the parents sale proposal, whether it is upwards or downwards).

I am talking about the villages like your friend is living, its a fact of life there, hope you don't resist the truth anymore.

If anyone wants to change the system, get out of it and lead by example(and not arrange for handsome dowry and wait for a US groom/bakra!). If she is educated let her work and find someone worthy herself, whats so impossible in that?. Tell your friend and see what she tells you, no need to tell us, but u will understand which village we all are in!.

Fake Dowry case misusing 498A by lawyer daughter/ father duo.

She is an law attorney admitted to practice in Bombay.
She came to USA on Fiance K-1 Visa to marry US Citizen.
She married in USA Court and subsequently she was
divorced by order of the Superior Court New Jersey USA.
Her father is senior practising advocate at Bombay High Court .

While the divorce proceedings against her were in progress in USA,
she realised that she can not stop the petitioner from obtaining divorce
against her and that she was not likely to get any amount of money or
property in settlement.

She resorted to the misuse of the police machinery in India, with oblique motives
to bring pressures, wreak revenge and unleash legal-terror. She filed complaint at
Police Station in Bombay, making allegations against each and every member of
the family ( USA Citizens) alleging cruelty to her in USA.

The complaint was the Counter-Blast to the on going divorce proceedings in USA.
She did not disclose in the complaint, that there was divorce case pending against
her in USA, and the same was being contested by her and her lawyer father; in
which they had demanded / claimed US $ 200 Thousand in settlement.

someone please stop the sniffer spam

Seema: I cannot imagine how I could even begin to explain to you where some of these guys are coming from. Its best you just not try to understand.

People say man evolved from chimpanzees and yet when we see some of the stuff that chimpanzees do we cannot possibly rationalize their actions or explain what they are saying. We just have to wait for evolution to catch up with those that were left behind.

As for the dowry business: its a vicious cycle. those that pay it blame the ones who accept it. those that want it have to find a way to justify their greed and therefore will blame the ones paying it up.

Those who can not imagine should blame themselves for their poor minds.

Some of the last few comments seemed to be desperate attempt at racial slur which is obviously oblivious to the fact that distance between x and y is the same as distance between y and x.
So much so for the evolution from chimpanzee...

BTW, that reminds me of somebody posting a link to an article (in a journal) a while back, which stated that as far as genetic composition is concerned human females resemble chimpanzees more than human males.

Yes I am a "poor minded" unimaginative racist and you siffers are friggin imaginative genuises....so figure out a goddamn loophole for ur problems then and stop the moanin and bitchin.

While you guys are at it could some of u also be civil (I know its hard for you but try, try) and pls stop posting duplicate comments and spamming. That shouldn't take much imagination now should it?

I consider the act of giving and accepting dowry far beneath my honour and dignity; it's just like offering and accepting bribes.

I consider men who accept dowry as greedy, spineless people who don't have an iota of self-respect and honour. I would spit on a man and his family who willingly and gleefully accept dowry.

Similarly, girls' families who offer dowry too lack self-respect and confidence, as they don't think too highly of their own girl.

It's as if the girl's family is trying to buy over a guy to get rid of her. The most terrible thing about many Indian (mainly Hindu) families and their marriage customs is that subconciously, girls are thought to be a "burden" and any guy who's marrying them is doing the girl's family a great, great 'FAVOUR'.
Hence he (and his family) need to be appeased.

That's the worst despicable mental attitude ingrained in the DNA of so many Indians, which has got to change if we as a society have to get rid of this filthy practice called dowry.

That's why it's so important for girls (en masse) to get educated well, build careers and stand up on their own feet.
In my opinion, it's far better a girl goes unmarried than gets married unwillingly with a hefty dowry.

That's also why I prefer sensible love marriages to the traditional arranged marriages, which are more like business transactions.

Any gift should be earned through effort, respect and good-will, not as a bribe.

Love and peace to all,
Ayan

Ayan...What exactly stops you from spitting on a woman's face if they are bribing a male to meet their vested interests.

That's also why I prefer sensible love marriages to the traditional arranged marriages, which are more like business transactions.

In case you are not aware, marriage as defined in law is a "Contract" governed by financial(business) constraints like Alimony, money to woman in the name of maintenance and child support, return of dowry articles, right in husband's property and earnings e.t.c.

And all above are applicable for either type of marriages. So for a man it certainly does not matter whether it is a love marriage or an arranged one.

Kudos to Renuka. She attended the review meeting with male right activists today and declared that she will put a stop to arrest of innocent women. She has said she does not care about Indian men though as they have exploited women for 1000 years.

A harsher dowry law is on anvil. As per this law according to Renuka the provision to negate any marriage if the first wife decides to punish the husband. Thereby the husband cannot marry any other woman.
http://epaper.timesofindia.com/Daily/skins/TOI/navigator.asp?

Daily=TOIM&login=default&AW=1214397889375

[Edited: Spam]

Please analyse the problem in totality and not based on men and women.

Greed is the root of evil. man or woman both can be greedy.

`Lobhaah paapasya kaarnam' says ancinet sanskrit literature. Root of sins is greed.

Anybody can be greedy and we have to train the humanity to control 5 famous enemies greed on of them (kaam - Lust, Krodh-anger, Lobh-greed, Moh -attachment, Mad- arrogance/ego).

To control these five enemies of humanity, laws can never help. It is Dharma that kills these enemies.

But India being Dharamnirpeksh(isolated from Dharma as literal meaning) , these problems can never be solved without Dharma.

You people can keep on arguing for million years, unless greed controlling mechanism of Dharma is injected in people, this problem will never be solved.

Weak will continue to get exploited(man or woman whoever is weak).

Let's attack at the root of the evil ie Greed irrespective of who is infected with it man or woman?

This holistic approach will solve the problem in totality.

Firstly, I would like to take the time in thanking you all for your valuable time.
I am also a victim of this law.This law has been passed to destroy the indian husbands & their families.We are always going to remain backwards.The western countries have always been ahead of us and they will always remain ahead.If you are the judges/lawyers/ mp's and police, it won't be long when you too will be a victim of this law.Everyday is not sunday.If God was here, he too would have been a victim of 498A and Domestic Violence.Every four minutes a case is filed against the innocent families.It is as easy as ordering pizza.If you think for a second, how could every family-in-laws be bad.Lastly, by calling someone a criminal, he/she doesn't become one, if India says so.That's a different story and no comments on that.Where corruption lasts forever.I feel sorry for the innocent families who are suffering from this 498A & Dv act.Many of them have committed suicide inside the jails and outside.How long can you live in luxury, if the money was earned falsely, for your kind information it won't last forever, and you are not going to live forever.You can bribe the police but you can not buy life by bribing God.May God Bless these women with some sense. Those that try to fly too high in a false world, always fall head first to the ground. According to me, this law should be brought to an end.It has done enough damage to the innocent families.Lastly , no more tulsi's are left in India and nowadays you would find the new 498A and Dv act tulsi's.Hey women you better change yourselves, it won't be long when the time changes and God isn't sleeping.I think people should marry the law instead of women.
Nowad ays. women in India look at the mans' pocket, rather than the qualities of the man himself. Is this what the world is coming to?Is this what India is all about?If this is the case, than I can say, that I am ashamed to be a part of India.The people of this country are a disgrace, because they are letting corruption, false cases, and lies eat away at the very people who are trying to help.Indian people in western countries look at India to get married, not because it's easy to do so, but because they are under the wrong impression that girls in India are decent. Well, I feel sorry for these people, because, they are going to learn through experience, as most of us have done.I agree that most women have suffered in silence, and yes their husbands deserve to be punished, but the women who are using this Law to extort money out of innocent families, should be given the worst punishment in history!!!
Dowry laws should be removed for good and who came up with this idea, India is to be blamed for the pathetic laws.

[conjectural]

New find just going through news

http://www.498a.org/contents/paperArticles/Renuka%20chowdhary%20puts%20498a%20on%20her%20daughter%27s%20husband%20and%20in%20law.pdf

i agree that the dowry problem exists and the brides family is at a disadvantage but i dont know why some people cannot admit that these laws are being misused and there should be safegaurds to prevent it and equally severe penalities for those who misuse it.

and this is not the only misandrist law that india has come up with. recently a new law states that SEX AFTER FALSE PROMISE OF MARRIAGE = RAPE.

http://www.ibnlive.com/news/sex-after-false-promise-of-marriage-is-rape-court/56328-3.html?xml

i think this deserves a new thread.