REVIEW

Book Review: Exodus

December 30, 2007
Sandeep

When it was first published, Exodus deservedly became an instant bestseller. In a brief period after its publication, it was translated into 50 languages. It remains an enduring, classic saga of the Jews, who as the book shows, "return home." That Leon Uris has poured passion into the book is apparent on every page.Exodus is almost an epic narrative of the history of Jews beginning somewhere in the late 1900s right up to 1948 when Israel was formally born. It is narrated through the spirit, deeds, and achievements of about five or six principal characters. It is touching and harsh, thrilling and depressing, gruesome and uplifting all at once. You cannot afford to be not shaken when you finish the book. Perhaps the Jews are the only race to undergo sustained indignities from every other race, in every country they migrated to, and emerged loftily victorious against centuries of insurmountable odds. The 500-plus pages of Exodus traces this journey to victory in painful detail.

The novel opens with an American journalist who lands in Cyprus in search of a long-lost friend. He discovers that the imperial British have placed thousands of refugee Jews behind barbed wires. These are "Hitler's refugees," the ones who survived his concentration camps. A passionate Jewish freedom fighter, Ari Ben Canaan is on a mission to rescue them and move them to Palestine against the British diktat of not allowing any more Jews into Palestine. That sets the tone for the rest of the book. Then Leon Uris slowly unrolls the canvas of both time and place through these refugee Jews. Karen, a German refugee, and Dov Landau the Polish Jew are the two other principal characters who accompany Ari on this journey. Ari is the son of a Russian Jew, Barak Ben Canaan who migrates on foot from Russia to Palestine. Through Karen's eyes, we get to read the now-familiar horrors of Hitler's Final Solution. Dov's tale unfolds the oppressive anti-Semitism that persisted for centuries in Poland climaxing again, with Hitler. Barak Ben Canaan opens the door on the Russian breed. The account of Barak and his brother, Akiva's journey by foot from Russia to Palestine is one of the most amazing sections of Exodus. Of the triumph of grit sustained by faith.

Every single chronicle has the same horrid strand: violent anti-Semitism and how the Jews' unshakeable faith as the faithful keepers of the laws of God kept them going....Simon Rabinsky was a believer among men. But even one so devout could not shut his eyes to the misery around.. him. "How long, O Lord...how long...must we live in this abysmal darkness?" And then his heart would grow light and he would become exalted as he repeated his favorite passage of the Passover Prayer--"Next year in Jerusalem."

Leon Uris casually throws the massive numbers of Jews killed in each land over several centuries: a few hundred thousand in Poland, a million in Russia, and Hitler's tally of more millions. What fascinated me was the strain of anti-Semitism in Poland. Despite declaring themselves as Poles first, the Polish Jews were betrayed by their fellow countrymen under German occupation. The author's sketches of Jewish ghetto life in Poland are very disturbing. Equally, their spirit of fighting the Germans "to the last man" are revealing.

Centuries of mindless anti-Semitism finally gave the Jews a new direction in late 19th century. The Dreyfus Affair really laid the seeds that gave birth to modern Israel. Herzl, who intimately covered the Dreyfus affair concluded that it was futile to counter anti-Semitism. He convened the first Zionist Congress. Herzl's efforts eventually culminated to the Balfour Declaration. An independent Jewish state would ensure to the Jews that Jew was no longer a term of abuse.However, the Balfour Declaration was really the beginning of prolonged British betrayal. Jewish cooperation in both world wars was rewarded with postponements and cloak-and-dagger games.

Imperial Britian wasn't willing to surrender her position in the Arab world. The British pitted the Arabs against the Jews and Arabs against themselves. Leon Uris documents the extent of British depravity when it pardoned known war criminals like the self-styled "Mufti," Haj Amin El Husseini. As late as 1945, the British still harboured illusions of its imperial grip despite staggering public opinion against its treatment of Jewish refugees. The British persist in this foolhardiness till the very end by voting against the Partition. As with its other colonies, the British has made a mess of the region when it left.

Without vocalizing it too much, the book correctly traces the roots of anti-Semitism to Christianity and specifically, the Crusades. He shows how the Arabs/Moslems held Jews in respect, or at the worst, tolerated them as second class citizens without killing them wholesale. This is unlike the indignity and brutality Jews suffered in Christian Europe.On the other side, Exodus shows what grit, determination, sacrifice and a spirit of unity can accomplish. Leon Uris describes in painstaking detail the prevailing conditions in Palestine and surrounding areas and how each wave of Jewish immigration--first in trickles, then in massive numbers after WW2--built a flourishing civilization in the most arduous geography. Uris brings this transformation alive. From hand-to-hand combat to full-fledged armed forces. In contrast, Uris shows how the Arab leaders use religion to keep their states in perpetual degradation. He portrays ordinary Arabs sympathetically, as prisoners of their own superstitions.

I don't want to dwell a lot on characterization and plot and other literary finery. For its own sake, the novel suffers from weak characterization but that's forgivable because the author operates in a constraint-bound atmosphere. There is little scope for characters to examine their thoughts and actions when a bomb is ready to fall any moment. It has huge gaps before the action moves forward. In fact, these pauses are more than a hundred pages. The description of the region's landscape is a little overwhelming and bores you after a point. You wouldn't miss anything if you skip ten pages in these sections. But you don't need to look at these aspects when you read Exodus.The choice of the title is significant. The original Exodus was the migration of Israelites from Egypt. The birth of Israel shows the migration of scattered Jews back into their holy land after two thousand years. The migration in itself pales in importance with its motive force: a tradition that was preserved for so long. When Barak Ben Canaan and his brother trek from Russia to Jerusalem, they seek out Jews in every village and town. Their faith in the faith of their fellowmen to tradition is intense and unerring. From the book,

In each village they asked, "Are there Jews here?" .... These Jews were different from any they had known. They were peasants filled with ignorance and superstition, yet they knew their Torah and kept the Sabbath and the Holy Days.

"Are there Jews here?"

"We are Jews."

"Let us see your Rabbi."

"Where are you boys going?"

"We are walking to the Promised Land."

It was the magic password....Never once were they refused hospitality.

When in 1948, the Promised Land finally declared statehood, Jews from all corners of the world poured into it. Yemen, Kurdistan, Turkey, France, Italy, (erstwhile)Yugoslavia, Czech, Rumania, Bulgaria, Britain, Greece, Algeria, Morocco, Egypt, Tunisia, South Africa, India, Canada, Argentina, Australia...

Exodus is without question a historical novel told from the obvious Jewish perspective. I cannot obviously cover everything in the space of a book review. I've purposely not dwelt on the evolution of the Israeli fighting forces, ideological differences (example, the Maccabees), and the important wars en route to freedom and after. My focus in this review was to showcase the extraordinary spirit of these amazing people. In an age when heroism is an obscenity, Exodus is mandatory reading. Some reviews hold the "Jewish perspective" against the novel to dub it "biased." It takes only a sick mind to detect a hidden agenda in a tale of Himalayan struggle because at the end of the novel, you feel elevated. I did.

Because Israel is the realization of Hope.

Sandeep works as a writer in an IT Services company based in Bangalore. Blogging is his latest and severely active hobby.
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#1
A. S. Mathew
December 30, 2007
06:59 PM

Since I did't read the book, I am not making any
commend in the context. Abraham is the father
of both Jewish and Arabs. The Jewish people are greatly blessed in one way but had to undergo
severe persecution down through the centuries.
New York is the financial hub of the world and that is controlled by the Jewish people.

Mathew 27:25. Jewish people elected to crucify
their own, Jesus Christ and loundly said " Then
answered all the people, and said, His blood be on us, and on our children". King Titus demolished Jerusalem in (AD 70) and Jews were
dispersed around the world. Some nations like
India, U.S.A etc gave safety protection but some
nations tortured them. " Jerusalem (foundation of peace) shall be the throne of the Lord of all nations" claim the most earnest thought.

#2
kerty
December 30, 2007
07:55 PM

AS

"Mathew 27:25. Jewish people elected to crucify
their own, Jesus Christ..."

I think that is highly inflamatory to blame Jewish religion or all Jewish people. I doubt that it was a jewish religious conspiracy or that all Jewish people were involved in crucifying Jesus. One can not blame all of Jewish people or their religion for acts of few people who happened to be Jewish. That is rabid hate and intolerance. I think Jewish people were subjected to the prolonged campaign of hate and intolerance by christians because Jews chose to cling to their religion and did not accept Christianity as their saviour. In spite of Jesus being a Jewish, Jews choosing to remain Jewish implied Jewish people abandoned one of their own and did not accept Jesus - for that, jewish people were revenged by forcing them to abandon their holy land and blaming the crucification on Jewish people mobilized mass anger and hate of xians to that end. That was pure savagery.

Your comment that Jewish people 'control' the financial hub of world exhibit the same accusatory mindset. No, all Jewish people are not into financial market, only some are. You will find many nationalities and people of many faiths active in financial market. No. Jewish people do not control the market. Financial Market is not a cartel that can be controlled by few individuals or institutions. Some jewish individuals might have achieved high profile in certain institutions and they might be very influential, but no body handed it to them because they are jewish - they earned their place and influence like everybody else. I hope you are not setting up blame game on Jewish people should financial market crash or undergo severe depression as a natural cycle. That is what Nazis did, blamed all economic problems of recession-bound Germen people on Jewish people. We already know what happened when mass anger was directed at them.

#3
smallsquirrel
December 30, 2007
08:11 PM

New York is the financial hub of the world and that is controlled by the Jewish people.

WHOT?

OK, I am not going to rail against you, but I have to tell you, A.S. that this is factually incorrect and really, really offensive. Kerty has explained why, above. I think you really need to dig deep and think about the stereotypes that you have, where you got them, and why you have them. Otherwise you are REALLY going to offend the heck out of someone one of these days.

Yes, the Jews killed Jesus, and the Christians killed Jews and la-dee-dah-de-dah. What good do all these ridiculous generalization do?

#4
commonsenseforall
December 31, 2007
04:02 AM

Matthew,

I really feel sorry for you. I understand that the policy of this forum is "personal attacks are not allowed", but I assume this policy also applies to attacks on entire community.

As smallsquirrel correctly points out, railing against you would be time and energy wasted. However, before you rail against some other community (religious, national, provincial, linguistic, sexual, whatever), do think for a moment before banging the keyboard. Or just reflect on my nick, "commonsense" and give your views a commonsense check. In fact I should not have wasted my time writing this...

#5
smallsquirrel
December 31, 2007
04:41 AM

common... well, the reason I said what I did is because I truly think that A.S. has said this out of ignorance and not out of hatred. Ignorance is a sad thing, and leads people to say all kinds of asinine things. but the thing is that there are very few jews here in India, and the knowledge about us is quite shoddy at best. Kids are not taught about the Holocaust, and this leads to things like Hitler-themed restaurants in Mumbai attended by Bollywood actors who think the whole thing is rather cute.

#6
Sandeep
URL
December 31, 2007
06:39 AM

small,

Awesome, and very perceptive.

>>...this leads to things like Hitler-themed restaurants in Mumbai attended by Bollywood actors who think the whole thing is rather cute.
Sad but true. Ignorance is worse than bias in this case.

#7
A. S. Mathew
December 31, 2007
10:11 PM

smallsquirrel 5#. Thank you for pointing out
my ignorance. When I was telling history, you might have felt that I am ignorant and anti-Jewish. When you see the number of friends I have among the Jewish, black, white, Spanish and
Indian and Pakistani communities, you will, in your life time will dare to
point your finger at me as " ignorant ". Your
commend was highly offensive. If desicritics is turning like a showcase of personal attacks, it
very sad. You don't know anything about me and
I pray that God may have mercy on your arrogant
attitude of hurting others.

#8
smallsquirrel
January 1, 2008
12:37 AM

A.S. what you said about Jews WAS ignorant. I do not really care how many Jewish friends you have. I live in India, am married to an Indian, have an Indian child and am STILL ignorant about many things having to do with India.

You really honestly need to grow up A.S. Seriously. I am telling you this not to hurt your feelings or to be mean. What you said about Jews ruling NY was not the truth. It was an ignorant comment.

I have also defended you here, but you don't see that. You only see when people criticize you, and you don't take it in the right spirit.

I don;t need for you to ask God to have mercy on me. I have my own relationship with God, and God knows my intention for telling you what you said was wrong. Maybe God should have mercy on you for your quick temper and insolence, nah?

#9
commonsenseforall
January 1, 2008
03:45 AM

AS Matthew,

You charge the Jews for killing Christ and have the gall to pretend that YOU are hurt! As for having Jewish friends, that's a tactic that nobody falls for anymore...You are a sad case man/woman!

#10
kela
January 1, 2008
07:31 AM

well AS MAthew is not entirely wrong
The following is a list of Jews or Jewish families who control the financial markets- http://www.radioislam.org/islam/english/toread/frnklin.htm#finance

#11
smallsquirrel
January 1, 2008
07:37 AM

kela... you're ridiculous. but thanks. yes we all know that there are jews in finance. but there are a lot of other people, too.

plus, you're quoting islamist propaganda here, and I am pretty sure it's not a reliable source.

but thanks for outing yourself as a nasty bigot.

#12
kela
January 1, 2008
08:23 AM

it took me 5 secs to google it

#13
smallsquirrel
January 1, 2008
08:37 AM

and that's about all it's worth too

do you have no shame?

#14
kela
January 1, 2008
09:59 AM

on the contrary ,just consider this,just 5 secs on google to come up with such a definitive result.

#15
smallsquirrel
January 1, 2008
10:07 AM

definitive? are you serious?!??!

you crack me up.

I got a bridge in kolkata I can sell ya cheap!

#16
kela
January 1, 2008
10:28 AM

is it near the jewish area?

#17
kela
January 1, 2008
10:30 AM

anything jewish or kolkata stinks..

#18
kela
January 1, 2008
10:33 AM

the only reason jews cosy up to hindus is because they hope to use them as pawns against the pakis

#19
sandeep
URL
January 1, 2008
10:42 AM

smallsquirrel,

I'm commenting a little late. Kela is an old suspect. Sorry you fell for his bait.

#20
smallsquirrel
January 1, 2008
10:59 AM

sandeep... yeah I know. I am also an author on this site and have had my run-ins with him. waste of time and energy!

#21
kela
January 1, 2008
11:05 AM

comeon ,the holocaust is just jewish propaganda,never have any mass graves been found and all the movies coming out of hollywood ,made by jews,like schindlers list always show how well behaved german soldiers were and jews - scheming,self-serving types

#22
smallsquirrel
January 1, 2008
11:07 AM

kela... there is a lot of things I will stand for... but you MOCKING my relatives who were murdered in the holocaust is NOT one of them.

go to hell and burn there.

editors,,, please give kela another in a long list of warnings

#23
kela
January 1, 2008
11:17 AM

do you remember their names , or are you just spewing jewish propaganda ?
the movie - the pianist too doesnt show jews in a very good light

#24
smallsquirrel
January 1, 2008
11:22 AM

yes I do remember the names of my grandfather's sisters who died in poland.... you are well and truly a pig and you owe all of my family a huge apology.

#25
kela
January 1, 2008
11:34 AM

you can't call me a pig and expect me to apologise ,thats not fair

#26
kela
January 1, 2008
11:38 AM

and besides people die in war like is happening in iraq....we're talking mass graves here

#27
Sujai
URL
January 1, 2008
12:21 PM

It is a good book. I read it long ago, but I can still remember some of the stories. Modern Israel is built by people who had to undergo great pains for thousands of years - only because of irrational thinking, blind belief, superstition - all ingredients of most religions on this planet.

Another book by Leon Uris, Mila 18, is another tale of heroic people who put a great fight against the might of Germany Army.

#28
smallsquirrel
January 1, 2008
12:48 PM

hey kela, since you are such a wizz with google, try a search for jews + mass graves.... while you are at it, look at the images for that search

you are simply a liar and a sick person trying to drum up anger. however, with something that horrific, you should very well know better

yes, mass murder is happening in Iraq, but that is not the subject here. one thing does not invalidate the next

and yes, even though I called you a pig, and with very good reason (you insulted my race and my relatives with no provocation and no reason whatsoever except bigotry) you absolutely do owe me an apology.

what is not fair, you sophomoric instigator, is you saying horrible things about someone's dead relatives simply to be provocative.

#29
kela
January 1, 2008
01:00 PM

http://archives.cnn.com/2001/WORLD/europe/06/04/poland.grave/index.html
Gross's book alleges that Polish villagers went on a murderous rampage through Jedwabne, then herded the remaining Jews into a barn near the local Jewish cemetery and set it alight, killing nearly all of the town's 1,600 Jews.

#30
sandeep
URL
January 1, 2008
01:39 PM

Kela,

I like your persistence in returning to get your behind whacked. Dude, you're not even worth PITY.

Sorry DC guys,
I HAD to say this.

#31
Ruvy in Jerusalem
URL
January 2, 2008
06:28 AM

Sandeep,

Before getting involved in the inane stupidity started by A.S. Matthew, and continued by that holocaust denier, kela, let me comment on your review, which was finely written, and which has gone sadly neglected here.

It is extremely important to comprehend that in writing the NOVEL Exodus, Leon Uris took quite a few liberties with history.

Uris took the vicious acrimony that was so characteristic of Eastern European Jewish life, and wove it into the plot, taking his version of MAPAI as the model of "Barak ben Cana'an's" organization and the Revisionist Zionists as the model of his more intemperate brother's invention, the Macabbees.

The actual Exodus 1947 was an American ship, and old one capable of just one more run, and procured to bring refugees to the British Mandate. In the novel, and the subsequent movie, the ship breaks the British blockade because of the balls of its leaders, and the passengers disembark in joy, doing the hora as they realize that they have come home to freedom at last.

The actual Exodus 1947 was boarded by the British after a shootout, and the ship's passengers were sent off to Madagascar or some such place. In any event, it was one of the events that convinced the Brits that my country was not worth holding on to any more, and they dumped the Mandate onto the laps of the UN General Assembly, informing the UN that they were leaving, 15 May 1948 come hell or high water. We're well rid of the deceitful and perfidious bastards.

As a writer, Uris realized that he had the basis of another novel in his chapter called Mila 18, which dealt with the resistance of Jews in Warsaw against the Nazis. As a writer myself, I have to admire how he used that chapter, and later the NOVEL Mila 18 to Hollywoodize the story of Jewish resistance in Warsaw, as he had used the novel Exodus to Hollywoodize the story of the rebirth of our nation. This Hollywoodizing of the facts had worked certain benefits for us Jews in the 7th decade of the 20th Century, but with respect to the story of Jewish resistance in Warszawa, has ultimately worked damage.

With respect to Mila 18, the reality is that there were two headquarters of Jews fighting the Nazis. The Socialist Zionists (hashomér hatz'aír)and the Revisionists (betá"r). The Socialists had their HQ at Mila 18. I don't know where the Revisionists had their HQ. But thepoint is that sever members of hashomér hatz'aír survived to tell the tale. The Revisionists had survivors in Lodz, and it took years for the evidence of the Revisionists in Warszawa to surface. One reason was that everyone was caught up in the drama of Mila 18.

One final point to be made about Uris's book Exodus. It should never be forgotten that Uris was an assimilated American Jew, and he wove the plot so that the hero married out of the faith. This device was pulled straight out of Israel Zanwills' 1900 play, The Melting Pot. That Uris couldn't see that this was wrong and did not belong in a novel about the rebirth of the Jewish nation should tell you a lot about Uris' ultimate view of a Jewish state, and ultimate view of Jews in the world.

#32
Ruvy in Jerusalem
URL
January 2, 2008
06:37 AM

Sandeep,

I apologize for several spelling and grammatical errors. The play The Melting Pot was written by Israel Zangwill. Several members of <hashomér hatza'ír survived the Warsaw Ghetto Revolt to tell the tale. The story of the Revionists was only gotten from Jews fighting in Lodz who had had contact with them.

#33
Ruvy in Jerusalem
URL
January 2, 2008
06:43 AM

kela,

You owe smallsquirrel a huge apology for your insulting comments, and while my father never told me the names of our family that the Nazis killed, I know they died at Treblinka, originally an innocent lake in rural Poland before the Nazis and their Polish collaborators turned it into death camp. Your comments reveal the mind of stupid pig, rolling in the mud seeking out attention for no reason other than to receive it.

#34
Ruvy in Jerusalem
URL
January 2, 2008
06:58 AM

A.S. Matthew,

If you wish to admire Jesus, feel free to do so, but from my point of view, their was nothing special about the guy, except an overweening arrogance in being willing to rewrite basic Jewish law (like kashrut), and a bloodthirstiness that was visited upon him justifiably. It was Jesus who said "those who deny me, bring them to me and slay them in front of me." Fitting of a Wahhabi, I'd say, not a wandering nazír.

As for his miracles. go read the book of Kings II, where it talks about Elisha. Most of the things credited to Jesus were done by Elisha.

All in all, Jesus is not someone I would admire....

#35
kela
January 2, 2008
11:45 AM

Wow,the little squirrel is no hurry to scamper over here and censure the dastardly comments of this bastard and they have the gumption to want me to apologise,my nice chiselled ass i will

#36
Chandra
January 2, 2008
11:53 AM

Kela

How is your Airtel connection now?

#37
kela
January 2, 2008
12:03 PM

Chandra,they were very kind to give me a refund but my sony walkman phone has gone kaput and they won't replace it ,can you do anything about it?

#38
smallsquirrel
January 2, 2008
12:04 PM

kela I have nothing more to say to you. you are simply a pimple on the ass of progress.

#39
kela
January 2, 2008
12:09 PM

Christanity is the greatest religion in the world,at least we dont produce the extreme nut-jobs like Ruvy

#40
smallsquirrel
January 2, 2008
12:18 PM

#39... HA! LIAR.... just go visit sites like:
www.godhatesfags.com or other such fundy christian websites

kela, you are a moron.

#41
kela
January 2, 2008
12:30 PM

i dunno abt god but i do hate fags and it has nothing to do with me being a christian..
btw i don't see the lambas here ,looks like they've gone on a lamba vacation,does that make you defacto editor/censor?

#42
Aaman
URL
January 2, 2008
12:56 PM

Hamare jasoos jail ke kone kone mein hain... You're doing such a good job of burying yourself we don't need to help. FWIW, everyone's entitled to their opinion, but refrain from name-calling and hate speech

#43
Kela
January 2, 2008
02:33 PM

Kela

Sony can be fixed. Any possibility of travelling to kolkata soon? I know somebody there

#44
commonsenseforall
January 2, 2008
10:29 PM


kela wrote"

"Christanity is the greatest religion in the world,at least we dont produce the extreme nut-jobs like Ruvy"

Are you for real? As in, are you a real banana? Or are you just trying to deliberately incite hatred against Christianity?

#45
kela
January 3, 2008
03:43 AM

Commonsense - i am as real as they come.
Chandra-i need a replacement for my phone,repairs cant be done ,motherboard has to be changed,this particular phone is a defective one,i've come across lots of compalints,been fightng my case for 6 months now

#46
Ruvy in Jerusalem
URL
January 3, 2008
04:36 AM

Christianity is the greatest religion in the world....

Only the greatest religion in the world could produce a court that would disinter a dead pope, prop him on a seat and put him on trial.

Three cheers for the god-on-a-stick and his adherents, kela!

Would you like me to nail up a few more examples of the greatness of Christianity for you? Always willing to help, you know....

#47
kela
January 3, 2008
05:00 AM

They have come a long way from that,didn't Pope John Paul apologise for past crimes ?
Anyway what good is judaism for a non-jew like me ? you are the chosen people and you have the promised land,so what does that make me ? a second class ,sub-human ...?should i rejoice in your good luck being born a jew and hope i become one in my next birth ?
Also you didnt answer my question,why this cosying up with hindu Indians ?you just want to ride them don't you ,like you do the americans ?well the americans are smart but i dunno abt the Hindus.

#48
kela
January 3, 2008
05:24 AM

anti-semitism is over-rated especially in this part of the world.We have millions of people in India dehumanized as untouchables/low-birth/sub-human ,who have lived as such for thousands of years,spare a thought for them;the plight of the jews is nothing compared to theirs.
Also spare a thought for the Palestinians whose land was taken away from them to be illegally occupied

#49
Ruvy in Jerusalem
URL
January 3, 2008
06:18 AM

Anyway what good is Judaism for a non-Jew like me?

What makes you so wonderful that we should even want you as one of us? We don't seek converts, Kela. And from what I've read, even if we did go chasing after converts, I'd definitely not try to bring YOU into the fold. We could do far better.

#50
smallsquirrel
January 3, 2008
06:23 AM

ruvy... any clue what this meshugener is on about with the jews "cozying up" to indian hindus?

there is a trend?

there are like 5 jews in India, so this must be one serious thing he's spotted.

#51
Sandeep
URL
January 3, 2008
06:34 AM

Guys,

Let's relax and enjoy Kela's slipping-on-the-banana antics. He refuses to get himself treated.

#52
kela
January 3, 2008
06:48 AM

Ruvy, i am wonderful because i am in peace with others and i am happy.What about you?your posts speak for yourself ,you're a miserable,disgruntled jew.
And as for you SS,you're really pathetic,calling others names seems to be your fav pastime yet you're the first to complain and whine when you're at the receiving end

#53
Ruvy in Jerusalem
URL
January 3, 2008
07:20 AM

ss,

This meshiggener definitely has problems. He doesn't like being ganged up on by the only two Jews who comment on the list. He's not used to being used as a soccer ball... He'd like to make us all out to be parasites of one kind or another, but his English just isn't good enough for it.

If you're spotting a trend at all, it is an emerging Jew hatred among certain Christians in India.

#54
kela
January 3, 2008
07:39 AM

[EDITED]

#55
smallsquirrel
January 3, 2008
07:46 AM

THAT is grossly anti-semitic. would you like to also call us kikes then kela, will that make you feel better?

moderators, is there no difference between calling some one crazy and using hate speech? I think it's time someone put a stop to kela's antics.

#56
kela
January 3, 2008
07:49 AM

and you don't see Ruvy referring to jesus as "God on a stick" .... ?

#57
smallsquirrel
January 3, 2008
07:53 AM

he insulted jesus, not you.
while I choose not to insult jesus, if ruvy wants to that is HIS business. but I am a jew and I take serious offense to your rampant anti-semetic and ridiculous slurs.

#58
kela
January 3, 2008
07:57 AM

i take serious offence to him mocking my god,would he dare do that to the muslem god ?he'd be slaughtered like a goat

#59
Chandra
January 3, 2008
08:21 AM

SS-47

Aren't you half christian?

rgds

#60
Chandra
January 3, 2008
08:32 AM

Kela

You are easily the funniest guy on desicritics....why dont you write something really funny and post here? :-)

#61
smallsquirrel
January 3, 2008
08:39 AM

chandra... I assume you mean me even though 47 was not my comment...

you cannot be HALF a christian. christianity is not something that is passed on like judaism or hinduism, both of which have rules (judaism is passed on from the mother, and hinduism from the father) or traditions about them. christianity is more like a choice or an act of faith. not that those other religions also are not.. but hopefully you can see what i am saying....

so no, I am not half christian. :)

#62
Ruvy in Jerusalem
URL
January 3, 2008
08:47 AM

I do not mock G-d, Kela. No Moslem will mock MY G-d, Kela, because he worships my G-d, and he knows it. But if he comes after ME, I'll break his skull with a baseball bat.

Be grateful for the distance between us. In your case, it is a blessing for you.

#63
Raj Mehta
January 3, 2008
10:03 AM

Ruvy and Smallsquirrel- kela is just a harmless [EDITED].Like a little puppy he craves attention. Attacking jews, questioning holocaust is just his way of getting your notice. Dont indulge him.

#64
Chandra
January 3, 2008
10:54 AM

SS

Well...you have taken the discussion to another level. I somebody jewish if they marry outside the community? The parsis for example have a big issue if you marry outside....so..my question is as follows

a. What happens if a jewish person marries a christian or a hindu. Does the child remain Jewish

b. What happens if a jewish person marries a christian or a hindu. Is the person accepted as jewish

Here I wish to understand not from a belief perspective but from what the scriptures say.

thanks in advance...


rgds

#65
smallsquirrel
January 3, 2008
11:12 AM

chandra... the rules are very simple... if your mother is jewish, you are jewish! you may reject the faith part if you wish, but you are still ethnically jewish. many jews are not very religious... I am a prime example of that. I identify more as an ethnic Jew than a religious one.

my own marriage is a perfect example of what happens when a jew marries a hindu. i am a jew, and my husband is hindu. hinduism, as I understand it, is passed from the father, and judaism from the mom. We now have a HinJew daughter... she is free to choose any religion she wishes... be it Islam, Buddhism, Ba'hai, whatever makes her happy.

Many Jews marry outside their ethnicity and religion. The couple comes to their own conclusion about what shall happen. Jewish families, like any other families, have mixed reactions when this occurs... some are just fine, and some are not happy! The issue of Jewish identity is a complex one...

I am not sure I can really answer about what the Torah says about interfaith marriages. Orthodox Judaism prohibits it strictly, Reform Judaism discourages it but will allow it .. there are so many denominations with different beliefs, and one thing about Judaism is that we are encouraged to debate and understand meaning on their own (with educated guidance)

#66
kela
January 3, 2008
12:21 PM

Ruvy don't even dream of getting to me, i have two huge German shepherds guarding my house and if thats not enough [EDITED]

#67
Chandra
January 3, 2008
12:45 PM

SS

Thanks. That was quite insightful.

rgds

#68
Ruvy in Jerusalem
URL
January 3, 2008
07:38 PM

Ruvy don't even dream of getting to me

I stay as far away from people (I'm stretching the definition some [EDITED]) like you. I wouldn't filthy my mind with the thought, nor my hands with the deed.

#69
Ashish
URL
January 6, 2008
11:54 AM

With all this later discussion, the review again gets short attention. Read Exodus, then read O Jerusalem, and then you will get a better idea of what things were like then.

#70
Ruvy in Jerusalem
URL
January 6, 2008
01:51 PM

Ashish,

Thank you also for getting the discussion past the stupid acrimonies of some of the lesser lights at DC.

My whole point about the novel Exodus is that is a hollywoodization of the truth. It is a terrible romanticizing of the truth....

For something that is honest and emotionally moving (perhaps) try this Youtube link by Kalisto.

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