Subscribe to Desicritics
Cultural Conflict: Looking Beyond the Skin and the Tongue
Kishore
What does it take to hate a fellow human? Being a miser? A murderer? A hypocrite? How about because - he doesn't speak your language?
What you find today, in two of South India's prominent states is a deep rooted affliction of Cultural Insecurity. From the days of Tamil Nadu's opposition to Hindi in the 1960s, to Karunanidhi's attempts to impose Tamil-medium education in primary schools (which, thankfully, was overruled by the court), to Karnataka's opposition against the Tamil-speaking populace in the state with the repeated blocking of all Tamil channels in response to the Cauvery issue verdict - both these states have always tried to outdo the other with juvenile justifications of safeguarding the culture in their state.
Language provides a means of expression and social allegiance to those groups where one belongs. But cultural fanatism is taking social allegiance too far. It's not surprising anymore to see a section of Kannada speaking populace ranting childishly about the people from other states taking away their jobs in the IT industry. On similar lines, a section of Tamil speaking people trying to act as the guarding angel of Tamil Culture by prohibiting women from wearing Jeans in public.
Ramachandra Guha once told in a talk show,
Very often you could see an MGR saying in movies "I will give my life for Tamil". Or a Rajkumar saying "I will give my life for Kannada". But how often have you seen an Amitabh Bacchan saying "I will give my life for Hindi"?
This attitude of playing the Culture guardian stems from a perceived insecurity about their language and culture. One sect feels learning Hindi in Tamil Nadu would kill the Tamil language. Another sect feels, letting people from other states work in IT companies based in Karnataka would render the Kannadigas jobless.
But the fact remains that both are mistaken. Culture was not invented yesterday. It has lived through thousands of years and has survived the vagaries of time and history. Culture evolves. It transforms into a multitude of shapes over the ages. And it's not in the hands of a bunch of IT professionals or people speaking outside of their mother-tongue to destroy a culture. And something of this magnitude does not require a Government appointed 10-member committee to come up with a white paper on safeguarding culture. Culture knows better to safeguard itself.
The Clash of Civilizations theory couldn't have come true at a later time. It is a controversial theory that people's cultural identity will be the primary source of conflict in the post-Cold War world, as postulated by Samuel P. Huntington.
It is my hypothesis that the fundamental source of conflict in this new world will not be primarily ideological or primarily economic. The great divisions among humankind and the dominating source of conflict will be cultural.
Cultural conflict is what has blown up between the two states. A problem of river water sharing gets converted into a clash of languages. The crisis is not between the states, but between the states of mind of its citizens. A state of perceived insecurity about their culture.
Contrary to this perception, culture has a tendency to break free. It cannot be bound by barriers or forced to take a specific path. It needs to mingle and merge to grow, not confined into isolation. A lack of understanding of this nature of culture is making Huntington's theory a reality. And that is not a great news.
ramses
URL
February 6, 2007
07:14 AM
You are talking of an amalgamated 'culture'[if i use the word as fleetingly as you do] in the two states.
You fail in analysing. How so when you contradict yourself with the last para.
Anupallavi
URL
February 6, 2007
07:58 AM
You are all over the map and on the fence on most points. Shall we call a spade a spade and take a stance ? Having a weak opinion to please all is worse than having none at all.
1. Karnataka's opposition against the Tamil-speaking populace..
2. It's not surprising anymore to see a section of Kannada speaking populace ranting childishly about the people from other states taking away their jobs in the IT industry
About (1), when was the last time you heard Shimoga, Karkala, Koppa or Sirsi complain about "Tamil" ? Probably never? Do you hear Bangalore complain ? Oh yeah, every day. So it's not Karnataka, it's Bangalore....? I am a proud Bangalorean and you will hear me complain, and justify why.
Let's look at why & (2). For that we need to relinquish the preachy, moral & cultural high ground and venture into the lives of the populace down in the pits...
A reliable estimate is that only 30 per cent of Bangalore's residents speak Kannada . The last few years of the IT boom have made it a silicon valley, a city dominated by non-Kannadigas. There is of course no justification for saying that a territory of the Indian nation be inhabited by only the members of one linguistic community, in case of Karnataka, the Kannadigas. Unfortunately, the reality is too twisted to be fitted into such idealistic framework. Bangalore is no different. For that matter any Indian city would react the same way. Probably a lot worse than Bangalore has. Mumbai had its Marathi awakening in the last decade plus, Bangalore is at similar crossroads..
When in Rome, be a Roman. Kannada chauvinists are definitely wrong in saying non-Kannadigas are stealing their jobs . In the same vein, Tamils, a big majority of the non-Kannada population in Bangalore, need to ensure they blend in and help their cause as well as the city's. 1991 riots were as much linguistic as it was about water. When in college in 1991, we had 2 groups in most of our classes, Tamil & Non-Tamil. It was a sad state of affairs for Kannada. If at all you were to have groups, I would expect a Kannada, Non-Kannada group in a college in Bangalore, but it was, Tamil & Non-Tamil. A lot of that discontent flowed to the streets. Not pretty, but if there are pent up emotions, it is just a matter of time.
Little has changed since then. A majority of the non-local population decide to not learn Kannada and blend in. On the way to Chicago 2 months ago, I met a father-daughter traveling for an college admission in the city. They had stayed in Bangalore the last 25 years and did not know an iota of Kannada. Their justification ? "We live in Ulsoor-Indiranagar area and Tamil/English will suffice". How is that supposed to help ?
We often hear about Tamil-Kannada conflict and not a Kannada-Gujrathi conflict. Why ? Gujrathi numbers are not compelling you may say. Then lets take Telegu ? There are abundant Telegu'ites in Bangalore. When was the last time you saw a Shetty(Bania) who could not speak Kannada? But you do find thousands of construction workers who do not know Kannada for nuts. It is the same with educated-class Tamils as well. The reason is, for "most(not ALL)" Tamilians, picking up another language (sans English) translates to being Un-Tamil, be it Hindi or Kannada.
When you decide to come live in a different culture, it is you moral duty to blend in and not stick out like a sore thumb. If you do stick out, it is bound to stress the cultural fabric no matter how old or how evolved the culture is. You see the fissures in Karnataka-TN or Maharashtra-Gujrat or Russia-Latvia. When the local populace is threatened of losing it's identity, it will stand up and show spine.
Hell, even in USA(the melting pot), it is a constant chant to the Spanish populace : If you want to live here, learn the language....
So why is Bangalore any different ?
Kishore
URL
February 6, 2007
08:15 AM
ramses,
Culture will survive. But I can't speak of the culturally insecure.
Anupallavi,
Thanks for the comment. Learning the language of the state one resides in sure enables them to go about their things in a better way, but I would still not agree that it would end up dooming the language of the state.
You have a point, but trouble brews when the love of language gets converted to resitance against 'outsiders' and fear of losing the home culture to outsiders. It's a xenophobic attitude. Culture is here to stay, whenther one learns the local language or not.
As you say, it happens in USA as well. It, too, suffers cultural insecurity.
Anupallavi
URL
February 6, 2007
09:51 AM
People have lived in a state for 5+ years and have not picked up basics of the spoken 'get-by-a-day' language and you expect them to delve into culture ? How would that work? I do not understand Kannada, but let me read a book of Kuvempu ? Or I have no clue about local folklore history but will see a Yakshagana or a Sangya Balya play ? Sure !
70% of the town not speaking the basics of the local language and locals being concerned is no xenophobia. If I relocate to Chennai I will learn Tamil, if you come into Bangalore better pick up some Kannada. That's all they are saying,that's fair enough.
Hope you have picked up some of the local language Kishore. I see you talk of Chennai("Down Memory Lane...") & now reside in Bangalore...
Kishore
URL
February 6, 2007
10:29 AM
Anupallavi,
That's fair enough. Just wondering, when was the last time I heard somebody talk of Unity in Diversity and all that jazz.
I know of a couple - Husband whose mother-tongue is Tamil and wife whose mother-tongue is Telugu. They've been married for 8+ years. They converse in English. They speak no more than a few words of their spouse's language. And they are Happily married.
Though I agree with you on your individual points, I still feel forcing one into learning a language is not the right way to go about it..
Okay, that underline was supposed to mean something eh? :)
I certainly have picked up a bit of the local language, but not by force. And my local-language speaking friends are perfectly at peace with me. :)
Anupallavi
URL
February 6, 2007
01:02 PM
Kishore,
Unity in Diversity definitely does not disregard the individuality of the states/regions. It's unity despite the diversity. Sum of parts ; the force that binds us being stronger than what tears us apart.
If force was big factor we would not have a 70% non-Kannada populace in Bangalore. Would we ? :) . Infact we Kannadigas are reputed with letting things slip by in the name of cosmopolitization.
About the couple, I'm sure each of us can come up with a big list of people arguing our sides of the story. To me it is a matter of principle. If I go live in a different linguistic locale, I deem it necessary to know enough to at least get around and make some meaningful chit chat with the locals. I have lived in Andhra and I can speak decent Telegu ...
Kishore
URL
February 6, 2007
01:37 PM
Anupallavi,
Precisely! As a principle I do agree that knowing the local language is really good. But then doesn't "principle" become the discretion of an individual? If he follows, good for him. If he doesn't, then it's just his way of life. Why should we scoff at him?
Anupallavi
February 6, 2007
06:43 PM
*sigh*
Hope that conveys my sentiment. If not this exchange is hopeless..
Kishore
URL
February 6, 2007
07:06 PM
Anupallavi,
Your sentiments are justified. But the link you have pointed is a personal viewpoint of the author of that post/comment. The fact that the author/commentor is a Tamilian does not change my view.
Everyone are entitled to their own views, right? So let's just agree to disagree on this. :)
Desigirl
URL
February 7, 2007
04:18 AM
I know of a couple - Husband whose mother-tongue is Tamil and wife whose mother-tongue is Telugu. They've been married for 8+ years. They converse in English. They speak no more than a few words of their spouse's language. And they are Happily married.
Oi oi! Watch it!!!
Sujatha
URL
February 7, 2007
05:27 AM
Kishore, why would you feel forced to learn the local language? Shouldn't you want to learn it? If you went to a foreign land (forget other states of India), don't you feel like partaking of life as the locals do? If the language were different than yours (let's say French or Italian or German), wouldn't you get a kick out of learning to speak those languages and conversing with the locals (even though they might speak perfectly good English)?
Sujatha
URL
February 7, 2007
05:34 AM
Anupallavi, do you have a blog or other website?
Kishore
URL
February 7, 2007
07:30 AM
DG,
oopps... Coincidence. Pure coincindence, I never realized the similarities, but it's not who you think... :)
Suj,
I agree it's good to learn the language. My only point is, a localite should not say - "learn my language or get out of this place".
Shweta
URL
February 9, 2007
08:53 AM
When you say culture has a tendency to break free, I totally agree with you, but just as with religion, man (as in human being) can & will use culture as an excuse or a platform to segregate and divide.... when it suits a personal or political agenda.
The public in many cases, who support these agendas, are most of the time just riding a wave, with no interest in the basic cause or the end result....
I agree with Anupallavi when she says Kannadigas let a lot slip by in the name of cosmopolitization. If it wasn't for this attitude anyone living in Karnataka would find it hard to survive... Imagine if auto drivers refused to talk to you in any other language but Kannada/English, or if people turned their nose up at you if you spoke in another language (like say Tamil?)
If anyone at all has to understand the concept of 'live & let live'; in other terms learn the language if want to, it has to be the Tamilians...
As for the "MGR saying I will give my life for 'Tamil', Rajkumar saying he will do it for 'Kannada' & Amitabh not saying he would do it for 'Hindi'"
My take on it is:
In the older times, pride for one's state was a big deal. Dialogues such as the above were used in context of taking about their States, giving their lives for the land (Tamil Nadu and Kannada Nadu)... I doubt if you'd find Rajkumar espouse this dialogue in every movie of his, but for the patriotic kinds..... As for Amitabh, which State would he give his life for? ... Uttar Pradesh, Haryana, Bihar, Madhya Pradesh, parts of Sikkim and Himachal Pradesh; where Hindi is the spoken language of the State? (In current times, you'd include Uttaranchal, Chattisgarh and Jharkhand).....
Kishore
URL
February 9, 2007
09:36 AM
Shweta,
Good points, worth another post. :)
Chennai is guilty of its indifference towards Hindi as well. So is Bangalore's fear of losing the Kannada identity and asking corporates to give preferance to Kannadigas..
>>In the older times, pride for one's state was a big deal
Not just older times. Karunanidhi attempted to force Tamil-medium education in primary schools in TN, and this happened just a few years ago. And it required umpteen PILs from nervous parents and judicial intervential to stop him. It's one thing to be proud of your state and language, but forcing is not...
Ki
URL
February 9, 2007
04:06 PM
There's a huge difference between Kannadigas (and the Sena, let's not forget that) wanting to force out non-natives and Tamils not wanting to learn Hindi. Unfortunately, you seem to think they're the same.
There's also the huge difference the average Bangalorean resent the presence of non-natives and Karunanidhi wanting to force Tamil in primary schools. You don't seem to be aware of this difference either.
The fact is most Tamils don't hate Hindi, we just don't think it's worth learning. We don't care if you speak it, but we do get pissed when you expect us to understand you. I think that's just human, not xenophobic. Xenophobia would be if we prevented people of the state from learning Hindi, or if there were riots in Chennai asking Hindi speakers to "go home."
Now, please write 100 times imposition: "Indifference is not xenophobia."
bachodi
URL
February 9, 2007
04:17 PM
about "personal viewpoint of the author of that post/comment. The fact that the author/commentor is a Tamilian does "
See what rulers think:
(CTRL+C , CTRL+V of this weeks week mag. report )
As a fledgling political party in the 1980s, the ___ took up unpopular measures like tree felling, as a show of strength. As the party grew in stature, it launched an environmental movement, Pasumai Thayagam, and planted trees as an act of atonement.
Later, it joined the _____ party in the Tamil Protection Movement against Tamil films with titles in other languages. They threatened to disrupt the shooting of films with 'un-Tamil' names. This led to widespread discontent in the film industry. Chief Minister found a simple solution: films named in Tamil would enjoy a waiver of entertainment tax.
The latest pressure exercise by the ___ is the Tamizhar Maana Meetpu Iyakkam, a movement launched on January 27 to redeem the Tamil pride in language, music, culture and history.
The first task of the movement is to ensure that Tamil is the official language in all government offices. "We have given two months to the government to follow this, failing which our volunteers will picket the offices,"
The next job is to ensure that people from other states do not exploit Tamils. "We do not mind people coming to Tamil Nadu to earn their living but we will not allow them to exploit Tamils,"
Kishore
URL
February 9, 2007
04:50 PM
Ki,
>> we just don't think it's worth learning.
There you go again!
Indifference is not xenophobia. But, in this case, indifference has given rise to xenophobia.
bachodi, Ki et.al.,
The topic is turning out to be a Kannada-Tamil issue, when these were supposed to be two instances of what I feel is a result of "cultural insecurity" of a section of people.
raj
February 9, 2007
10:43 PM
Kishore, why do you stubbornly resist reason?What xenophobia? Are Hindi-speakers being dot-busted in Tamil nadu? Victimised? Riots against non-tamils in TN? Have you heard of it ever? Riots against tamils in Banglaore? Sounds familiar, doesnt it? Papa, please dont preach.
As for Hindi, why dont you understand that not speaking/learning Hindi is not treason - it is a fundamental right for me not to speak Hindi. Hindi is not special. It is just one of the languages. No, No, there is nothing called the national language? Hell, if it were, have you ever thought why should tamils oppose such imposition? A language should become national on its own steam - not through force or implication that those whod ont speak it are anti-national. For crying's sake, understand that. Good luck with reason and logic in the future, man.
I think you better do that imposition - might ingrain some basic facts in your mind.
Deepti Lamba
URL
February 9, 2007
11:13 PM
Nothing should be made mandatory as far as culture is concerned. It should be a self driven motivation.
I am a Hindi speaking Indian living in Bangalore, been here for over six month and have realized that it isn't so difficult to understand either languages, well at least I manage to get the gist of the conversations whirling around me and its fun trying to decipher whats been said since most realize that I'm an eager learner and they are patient teachers.
Remember the old tale about trees that don't bend get uprooted? We have to keep evolving and not be stagnant.
One can live within the parameters of one's culture and yet learn something else from another culture but again it should not be thrust on people.
vatsan
URL
February 9, 2007
11:29 PM
and this debate is still goin on?
all those who dont agree with kishore, i think his post has indicated his understanding of the four southern states, its close to zilch and the issues involved. so i think this debate is a exercise in futility.
kishore, next time u post on something u do understand.
Damilan
February 9, 2007
11:47 PM
You can't force anyone to learn Hindi. It's the individual's choice to learn it or not. Period. At the same time no one stops you from learning Hindi in Tamil Nadu. To call opposition of imposing Hindi on people as Cultural Insecurity is highly idiotic.
Kishore
URL
February 9, 2007
11:51 PM
Dee,
Thanks! Atleast somebody understands my point.
I don't have anything about the Kannada-Tamil tussles.
My only point is - learning a language or not learning it or whatever must be left to sole discretion of the individual, and there is no sense in forcing someone into it..
Shweta
URL
February 10, 2007
01:44 AM
Kishore: Point noted, point understood. Free will and choice is everyone's right.... and if a person chooses to exercise that right where language is concerned it shouldn't be construed as cultural indifference..
While your article title implied that you might be touching on cultural conflicts arising from co-existance of different races (differnt skin color) & languages, you ended up focusing only on the two southern states, whose population has similar skin color, almost similar cultures & religions, but for the tongue.... Don't be surprised that your underlying message of 'exercising freedom of choice' got lost in the Kannada-Tamil debate...
I totally agree with your point btw... I live in Karnataka but can speak 5 languages fluently, can understand Tamil (I don't even live in B'lore); not because I needed to, but becoz it helps my communication skills & I love learning new languages.
vatsan
URL
February 10, 2007
04:04 AM
@kishore,
if u knew a little more about the entire anti-hindi protests and its origins, you will understand it began because hindi was forced upon tamil nadu.
in the 1960, all official communication was in the form of hindi, and people in TN din speak hindi. this was hindi imposition on the part of the central govt on the state govt. this was the trigger for the anti-hindi movement. later communication was in both hindi and english (whch people in tn spoke)
now do u get how the movement is because of the central govt imposing hindi?
next time do ur research before making such posts!!
vatsan
URL
February 10, 2007
04:15 AM
in 1965, sasthri and desai, against nehrus commitment, which said hindi wont be implemented hindi in states where they din want to, decided to implement hindi. its because of this hindi imposition that the movement arose, now can u stop quoting just that and also quote the hindi fanatics?
Kishore
URL
February 10, 2007
10:23 AM
Shweta,
Great! I'm not far. :) I've lived in Delhi, Chennai and now in Bangalore. So I speak all those languages they speak there fairly, and understand a couple more.
vatsan,
I give it you on the 60s issue. Now, you tell me the justification behind imposing Tamil-medium education which is more recent. Well, the point is - it's cultural insecurity that is driving people and not sensibility.
As I said, the post took "two instances" to explain the cultural insecurity of certain section of the people. May be I should have given another 10 examples, but that would have ended up in a complete digression from the crux of the point.
vatsan
URL
February 10, 2007
01:11 PM
kishore, you seem to assume that there is no cultural imposition of hindi, agreed it isnt govt sponsored, but it still exists.
when a north indian visits chennai, they speak hindi and don bother to learn the language, and expect ppl to speak hindi. this is a subtle form of cultural imposition. secondly, news media, too is myopic and ignores the southern states, once again delhi/mumbai and hindi cinema is given priority, under the name of national news channels. bollywood is equated to indian cinema. all this is a form f cultural imposition. this forces those in the southern states and north east to hold onto their nationalism.
understand cultural imposition also happens within society and isnt driven only by the state.
Agathian
URL
February 10, 2007
02:18 PM
Nice Article.. interesting comments..
I am a Tamilian, living in US and was in Bangalore for few months on work.. Admit i didnt pick up that much Kannada.
Thinking back - i probably would have picked up some, if i had to. The fact is, I was able to get by with my English and Tamil without much struggle. Whether it be shopping in a mall or street corner grocer.. Hitching a auto, eating in a restaurant, visiting places..etc.. etc..
I doubt this happened by design. It is pure economics.. Vendors and service folks pick up the language of their customer, because that is good for business. People lead busy lives [ and/or are inherently lazy ], so they dont pickup new languages if they can get by with what they know..
I am talking majority of people here.. Obviously there will be some section of fanatics.. Linguistic/ethnic/social/religious/otherwise..
The thing is, all these riots, fanned by politicians, end up creating more of those at the ground level - by creating insecurity/anger/fear.. IMHO... Discussions like this, even if it might cross lines at times, is lot more healthy..
Among my Tamil friends who were living in bangalore for a while, some had picked up Kannada well, some haven't.. Mostly going by the area they lived, people they have to deal with, workplace, etc.. etc.. I have Kannadiga friends who spoke good Tamil as well.. along the same lines.
Hindi agitation - it was a political mistake on part of the then central government to force Hindi on the fledgling country, with so many linguistic minorities. Mind you, i studied hindi, while living in Chennai. I dont hate Hindi or any language per se.. just pointing out the background of the issue..
As to mandating Tamil in primary schools - It is part political and part linguistic.. there were agitations going on against growing westernization of the society and also against the people from out of the state not picking up local language [ similar to bangalore and other places..]
While, like Kishore, i am against forcing anything on anybody... There are times i have felt that such measure is warranted - for the sake of the locals, not linguistic minorities. For ex. i have a few Telugu friends - who can converse in Telugu, but cant read or write.. While they can converse/read/write fine in Hindi/English. Primarily because they never had a chance to study their mother tongue in school - English medium with hindi for second language. I happen to think that is a shame.. There are so many treasures - linguistic/otherwise - in these languages, which will soon be forgotten...
Just my $0.02
thamizhan
URL
February 11, 2007
02:57 AM
Both MGR and Rajini say that they will give thier life to Tamil, becos both are not Tamils!
You don't have Sivaji or Kamal saying that.
Also comparing Tamil with Hindi is childish. Hindi is a baby among Indian languages and should not even come into the quotient.
Am glad that I live in Malaysia where Tamil is recognised as the language of Indians here and is an official language here besides a few other countries. Where else is Hindi outside India?
Pls put away you comparisons and read up. You should be proud that Tamil is an Indian language!
Rajesh
URL
February 13, 2007
04:02 AM
everybody knows how north indians will dominate given an oppurtunity. for them amitabh is the best actor and lata mangeshkar is the best singer(as though sivaji ganesan and p susheela are novice).
its lack of understanding on the core issue has made the author write like this. hope he does homework before posting
vijay
February 16, 2007
03:22 AM
@anupallavi,
I will use what you had used to explain the B'lore situation. We don't see the Tulus or Kodavas up in arms against the Tamils whether it is the cauvery issue or language issue. It is purely the b'lore Kannadigas as the Tamils tend to dominate in numbers in and around the cantonment region 'coz of historical settlement and not just coz of IT boom.
The Kannadigas tend to be dominant in North and Northwestern part of b'lore and the Tamil in the south and south eastern parts generally since the british times.
An interesting article on the b'lore issue:
http://www.iisg.nl/~sephis/pdf/nairpap.pdf
imparare
URL
April 15, 2007
03:11 AM
Interesting comments.. :D
Add your comment